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	<title>Comments on: Alecto Carrow: Hesiod, Dante, Eliot, Rowling</title>
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	<description>Thoughts for the Serious Reader of Harry Potter</description>
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		<title>By: Bruce</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6467</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 22:06:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6467</guid>
		<description>Not exactly, Amy.  Minerva was the Roman name for Athene.  Diana was the name for Artemis.  Athene&#039;s totem animal was the owl, and her great gift to mankind was the olive tree.  Harry&#039;s familiar is an owl, and his Quiddich mentor, assigned by McG. is OLIVER WOOD.  (McGonnigal is also the name of probably the worst poet in the English language; there are fanfictions that make him Minerva&#039;s Squib great-uncle.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not exactly, Amy.  Minerva was the Roman name for Athene.  Diana was the name for Artemis.  Athene&#8217;s totem animal was the owl, and her great gift to mankind was the olive tree.  Harry&#8217;s familiar is an owl, and his Quiddich mentor, assigned by McG. is OLIVER WOOD.  (McGonnigal is also the name of probably the worst poet in the English language; there are fanfictions that make him Minerva&#8217;s Squib great-uncle.)</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6439</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 03:51:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6439</guid>
		<description>Thanks (belatedly) for the welcome, Elizabeth!  I wish I could sit in on your class :)  That&#039;s one of the things I miss most about college, now that I&#039;ve graduated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks (belatedly) for the welcome, Elizabeth!  I wish I could sit in on your class <img src='http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   That&#8217;s one of the things I miss most about college, now that I&#8217;ve graduated.</p>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6433</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:53:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6433</guid>
		<description>Minerva was named for the goddess Minerva (aka Diana - JKR couldn&#039;t really use that name since it&#039;s also her sister&#039;s name :), in addition to evoking a very different image among the British), which is why she leads the white hats in the Battle at Hogwarts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Minerva was named for the goddess Minerva (aka Diana &#8211; JKR couldn&#8217;t really use that name since it&#8217;s also her sister&#8217;s name <img src='http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> , in addition to evoking a very different image among the British), which is why she leads the white hats in the Battle at Hogwarts.</p>
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		<title>By: Elizabeth</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6385</link>
		<dc:creator>Elizabeth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 17:32:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6385</guid>
		<description>Welcome, Rachel! Lovely post! Would you like to sit in on my lit class when we cover Oedipus :) We&#039;re also doing Yeats&#039;s Leda and the Swan next week, with some Clytemnestra cameos. I look forward to seeing you at FHS soon!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Welcome, Rachel! Lovely post! Would you like to sit in on my lit class when we cover Oedipus <img src='http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  We&#8217;re also doing Yeats&#8217;s Leda and the Swan next week, with some Clytemnestra cameos. I look forward to seeing you at FHS soon!</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6377</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 01:38:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6377</guid>
		<description>carriek9, I&#039;m intrigued by the connection you make with the Oresteia.  I’ve wondered for a long time about the significance of the Aeschylus quotation in the epigraph, having read the Oresteia during one of my freshman year literature survey courses in college.  It’s been awhile since I’ve read it, but if I remember, it’s essentially about an escalating cycle of violence within a family.  Agamemnon kills his daughter as a sacrifice to the gods before leaving for the Trojan war.  This, needless to say, upsets his wife (Clytaemnestra), and so she avenges her daughter by killing Agamemnon as soon as he gets home from the war.  Unfortunately for Clytaemnestra, in the ancient Greek world, killing a family member is one of the vilest crimes you can commit and demands vengeance.  Now, Agamemnon must be avenged, and so Orestes and his sister Electra kill their mother, Clytaemnestra, to avenge their father, Agamemnon.  You can see where this is going—when does the killing end?  Orestes doesn’t appear to have any other family members who are waiting to step up and avenge Clytaemnestra’s murder, and that’s where the furies step in.  As Mr. Granger pointed out, the furies, (the “dark gods beneath the earth” that are mentioned in the Aeschylus epigraph of Deathly Hallows) are responsible for avenging the dead and passing a karma-like judgment on those who have committed unholy acts.  So the third part of the Oresteia trilogy, the “Eumenides,” starts with Orestes being pursued by the furies and begging Athena (a.k.a. Minerva) to intercede for him.  And this is where the play gets a little odd to me.  There’s a sort of trial, with a jury and everything and with Athena presiding, in which Athena eventually persuades the furies to acquit Orestes of his crime and let him go free.  When they agree to this, she renames them “Eumenides,” which, according to Wikipedia, means “The Kindly Ones.”  Such a concession from the furies is, I believe, totally unprecedented in Greek mythology.  But even if it’s not, the renaming itself is a pretty drastic switch. And if I remember my undergraduate class discussion on this one (it’s been about four years), it’s hugely significant.  Not only have the furies been renamed, but their very nature has been altered.  They are now gods of kindness (mercy?) rather than gods of vengeance.  Not only that, but the order that they upheld has been turned on its head.  The unending cycle of violence, brutality, and terror has been broken at last.  In some ways, it’s a very hopeful ending.  

So I think, carriek9, that you may hit upon something very important when you note that “Alecto’s and Amycus’s names are given in order to clue the reader in to the fact that they are people who are incapable of thinking or responding in anything other than a primitive, violent way.”  Maybe this is a stretch, but perhaps by naming the Carrows after these brutal figures from Greek mythology (and especially by naming Alecto after one of the furies), Rowling is emphasizing that these two are enforcers of Voldemort’s world order, one in which brutality and fear rather than goodness and mercy keep people in line.  This is the order that Harry overturns at the end of the book.  His final defeat of Voldemort with “Expelliarmus” rather than a killing curse could be seen as his ultimate rejection of Voldemort’s violent order, as well as the ultimate triumph of mercy over violence.  I think it’s very significant, too, that Harry offers Voldemort the option of remorse rather than death (even if it’s all but hopeless that he will take this option).  Not sure where Professor McGonagall fits into all this, although the fact that she is named Minerva seems like it ought to be significant.    

Wow.  I feel a little pretentious writing a post that long.  I&#039;m really not an expert in this, just ruminating (and trying to remember what I learned in one of my undergraduate classes).     

Oh, and by the way, this is my first ever post, so hello, everyone!  I just recently discovered this site, and I can’t tell you how thrilled I was to find a group of people who were having serious, intelligent discussions about Harry Potter as a work of literature!  (Not to mention being charitable and civilized to each other—that seems to be rarity on the internet.)  Keep up the good work, everyone! You all have fascinating insights.  I hope Forks High School Professor gets back up and running again soon, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>carriek9, I&#8217;m intrigued by the connection you make with the Oresteia.  I’ve wondered for a long time about the significance of the Aeschylus quotation in the epigraph, having read the Oresteia during one of my freshman year literature survey courses in college.  It’s been awhile since I’ve read it, but if I remember, it’s essentially about an escalating cycle of violence within a family.  Agamemnon kills his daughter as a sacrifice to the gods before leaving for the Trojan war.  This, needless to say, upsets his wife (Clytaemnestra), and so she avenges her daughter by killing Agamemnon as soon as he gets home from the war.  Unfortunately for Clytaemnestra, in the ancient Greek world, killing a family member is one of the vilest crimes you can commit and demands vengeance.  Now, Agamemnon must be avenged, and so Orestes and his sister Electra kill their mother, Clytaemnestra, to avenge their father, Agamemnon.  You can see where this is going—when does the killing end?  Orestes doesn’t appear to have any other family members who are waiting to step up and avenge Clytaemnestra’s murder, and that’s where the furies step in.  As Mr. Granger pointed out, the furies, (the “dark gods beneath the earth” that are mentioned in the Aeschylus epigraph of Deathly Hallows) are responsible for avenging the dead and passing a karma-like judgment on those who have committed unholy acts.  So the third part of the Oresteia trilogy, the “Eumenides,” starts with Orestes being pursued by the furies and begging Athena (a.k.a. Minerva) to intercede for him.  And this is where the play gets a little odd to me.  There’s a sort of trial, with a jury and everything and with Athena presiding, in which Athena eventually persuades the furies to acquit Orestes of his crime and let him go free.  When they agree to this, she renames them “Eumenides,” which, according to Wikipedia, means “The Kindly Ones.”  Such a concession from the furies is, I believe, totally unprecedented in Greek mythology.  But even if it’s not, the renaming itself is a pretty drastic switch. And if I remember my undergraduate class discussion on this one (it’s been about four years), it’s hugely significant.  Not only have the furies been renamed, but their very nature has been altered.  They are now gods of kindness (mercy?) rather than gods of vengeance.  Not only that, but the order that they upheld has been turned on its head.  The unending cycle of violence, brutality, and terror has been broken at last.  In some ways, it’s a very hopeful ending.  </p>
<p>So I think, carriek9, that you may hit upon something very important when you note that “Alecto’s and Amycus’s names are given in order to clue the reader in to the fact that they are people who are incapable of thinking or responding in anything other than a primitive, violent way.”  Maybe this is a stretch, but perhaps by naming the Carrows after these brutal figures from Greek mythology (and especially by naming Alecto after one of the furies), Rowling is emphasizing that these two are enforcers of Voldemort’s world order, one in which brutality and fear rather than goodness and mercy keep people in line.  This is the order that Harry overturns at the end of the book.  His final defeat of Voldemort with “Expelliarmus” rather than a killing curse could be seen as his ultimate rejection of Voldemort’s violent order, as well as the ultimate triumph of mercy over violence.  I think it’s very significant, too, that Harry offers Voldemort the option of remorse rather than death (even if it’s all but hopeless that he will take this option).  Not sure where Professor McGonagall fits into all this, although the fact that she is named Minerva seems like it ought to be significant.    </p>
<p>Wow.  I feel a little pretentious writing a post that long.  I&#8217;m really not an expert in this, just ruminating (and trying to remember what I learned in one of my undergraduate classes).     </p>
<p>Oh, and by the way, this is my first ever post, so hello, everyone!  I just recently discovered this site, and I can’t tell you how thrilled I was to find a group of people who were having serious, intelligent discussions about Harry Potter as a work of literature!  (Not to mention being charitable and civilized to each other—that seems to be rarity on the internet.)  Keep up the good work, everyone! You all have fascinating insights.  I hope Forks High School Professor gets back up and running again soon, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Elizabeth</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6371</link>
		<dc:creator>Elizabeth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 10:36:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6371</guid>
		<description>When you say it out loud, you get  &quot;diagonally&quot;, which is its orientation; just so when you say Knockturn Alley out loud you get, appropriately enough, &quot;nocturnally.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When you say it out loud, you get  &#8220;diagonally&#8221;, which is its orientation; just so when you say Knockturn Alley out loud you get, appropriately enough, &#8220;nocturnally.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Martha</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6368</link>
		<dc:creator>Martha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 03:29:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6368</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t get Diagon Alley in Elizabeth&#039;s remarks.  I am new, and totally unsophisticated.  Please enlighten me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t get Diagon Alley in Elizabeth&#8217;s remarks.  I am new, and totally unsophisticated.  Please enlighten me.</p>
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		<title>By: revgeorge</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6359</link>
		<dc:creator>revgeorge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 20:45:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6359</guid>
		<description>Nice post, &lt;b&gt;John&lt;/b&gt;, but wasn&#039;t it Amycus who had the exchange with McGonagall?  Alecto was already unconscious in the Ravenclaw common room.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post, <b>John</b>, but wasn&#8217;t it Amycus who had the exchange with McGonagall?  Alecto was already unconscious in the Ravenclaw common room.</p>
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		<title>By: Arabella Figg</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6345</link>
		<dc:creator>Arabella Figg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 02:19:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6345</guid>
		<description>This is over my head, having studied none of these things, but I&#039;m impressed, and continue to learn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is over my head, having studied none of these things, but I&#8217;m impressed, and continue to learn.</p>
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		<title>By: carriek9</title>
		<link>http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/alecto-carrow-hesiod-dante-eliot-rowling/comment-page-1/#comment-6342</link>
		<dc:creator>carriek9</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:36:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hogwartsprofessor.com/?p=1308#comment-6342</guid>
		<description>I find it interesting that we have this connection with the Furies, which brings us back to the opening quote in DH from the Libation Bearers.  The next play in the Aeschylus trilogy is the &quot;Eumenides,&quot; which is a nice way of referring to the Furies.  You got me thinking about the significance of Amycus&#039; name.  I see that it also goes back to Greek mythology and it refers either to: (1) a pugilistic king who was the son of Poseidon; or (2) one of the group of centaurs who were invited to Theseus&#039; wedding, but got drunk and attacked the women.  Either way, Amycus is a brute and similar to Alecto in representing a violent, primitive way of behavior.  One of the more controversial scenes in DH involves Harry&#039; inflicting the Cruciatus curse on Amycus.  I would suggest that, rather than representing a judgment on Hogwarts, Alecto&#039;s and Amycus&#039;s names are given in order to clue the reader in to the fact that they are people who are incapable of thinking or responding in anything other than a primitive, violent way.  It would be foolhardy for Harry to treat them any differently.  And this takes me back to Dante and Canto 32 in the Inferno, when Dante is in the Ninth Circle of hell and he treats Bocca  Degli Abbati in a rather shockingly violent and brutal manner.  As McGonagall found nothing wrong with Harry&#039;s behavior, Virgil similarly has no criticism of Dante.  The moral here?  I&#039;m not sure.  But I did want to respond and to thank you for your continued blogs, which never cease to be thought-provoking and make me want to be a lit major again so that I can spend my time thinking about such things.  Bet wishes to you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it interesting that we have this connection with the Furies, which brings us back to the opening quote in DH from the Libation Bearers.  The next play in the Aeschylus trilogy is the &#8220;Eumenides,&#8221; which is a nice way of referring to the Furies.  You got me thinking about the significance of Amycus&#8217; name.  I see that it also goes back to Greek mythology and it refers either to: (1) a pugilistic king who was the son of Poseidon; or (2) one of the group of centaurs who were invited to Theseus&#8217; wedding, but got drunk and attacked the women.  Either way, Amycus is a brute and similar to Alecto in representing a violent, primitive way of behavior.  One of the more controversial scenes in DH involves Harry&#8217; inflicting the Cruciatus curse on Amycus.  I would suggest that, rather than representing a judgment on Hogwarts, Alecto&#8217;s and Amycus&#8217;s names are given in order to clue the reader in to the fact that they are people who are incapable of thinking or responding in anything other than a primitive, violent way.  It would be foolhardy for Harry to treat them any differently.  And this takes me back to Dante and Canto 32 in the Inferno, when Dante is in the Ninth Circle of hell and he treats Bocca  Degli Abbati in a rather shockingly violent and brutal manner.  As McGonagall found nothing wrong with Harry&#8217;s behavior, Virgil similarly has no criticism of Dante.  The moral here?  I&#8217;m not sure.  But I did want to respond and to thank you for your continued blogs, which never cease to be thought-provoking and make me want to be a lit major again so that I can spend my time thinking about such things.  Bet wishes to you.</p>
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